Author Topic: Indicators....  (Read 896 times)

Miti

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Indicators....
« on: March 25, 2016, 09:44:17 PM »
One of the up-market 'features' of the V1000 and Vampire when they were first sold was the addition of self-cancelling indicators...

The Hesketh design team took advantage of a system already developed (and fitted to late 70's GS1000 Suzukis).  This system was not quite 100% integrated with the other electrical assembles on the bikes - on the original Suzuki fit, there was a reed-switch installed in the speedometer head.  The Hesketh uses instruments originally designed for Honda, so this reed switch was missing on the Heskeths.  The Design Team 'improvised' with a rotary switch mounted between the speedometer-cable and the speedometer.  On my V1000, the OE installation looks like this:



The system was well-received, at first...  But, as the years went by, more and more Suzuki owners reported failure...  The self-cancelling unit proved to be a real weakness, with failure being commonplace and replacement astronomically expensive...  Heskeths are a much less populous breed and tend to cover less miles than the big Suzukis, but failures affect these too...  Mine decided to 'Go West' shortly before I was heading South last year.  Fortunately, I had access to a prototype replacement (designed and built by David Sharp) so all was not lost.

The prototype performed well last year, but it doesn't replicate the self-cancelling feature.  I have this on other bikes, so I do miss it at times...  So I decided to investigate possible replacements...

And I came up with this:



What we have here is a 'Badlands' ATS03 Indicator Control Unit.  It's an American product, designed to replace similarly problematic units fitted to Harleys...  It has 'built-in' self cancelling, will drive LED bulbs (without resistors) and has the added advantage of 'Hazard Warning Lights'.

Harleys use 'momentary action' switches for their indicators; one on each handlebar.  The momentary action of the Hesketh indicator switch mimics this and the unit is practically a 'plug and play' fit on the Hesketh.

The 'Harzard Warning Lights' are not so easy...  This requires that both indicators switches are pressed simultaneously on the Harleys - not possible on the Hesketh...

I surmised that this could be replicated through the use of relays and the 'off' switch on the Hesketh switchgear.  I discussed this with Dave Hartell and 'Voila..!' Dave came up with the Lucas SRB521 relay - (also in the picture) perfect for the job

I decided to mount the new unit in the same place as the original and, after some careful measurements, found that the OE bracket would allow a mounting plate of no more than 3mm thick - I used 3mm acrylic sheet in a lovely gloss black.  (It's 95 x 63 x 3 mm IIRC).



I use M4 csk machine screws and nylok nuts to mount the ATS03 and SRB521 on the acrylic sheet.



Then the hard part - removing the metal cover from the OE self-canceling unit, I 'harvested' the wiring harness.  I used crimp type terminals to connect the required wires to the relay and together too.  Those wires only connected to the ATS03 were jointed using crimp splices with a built in heatshrink cover - very useful..!



The new unit fits and works a treat...  Total cost was (about) £70...  It took me an afternoon to build and fit

.

The ATS03 units have to be ordered in from USA, but the relay and acrylic sheet are 'home grown'.  In fact, I found a good source for both, so I have a coupel of sheets and four relays 'spare'.  Let me know if you're interested - I can do wiring diagrams too...

Jeff



1975 Triumph Trident 750 (New Project)
1980 Yamaha XS1100 (Midnight Special)
1981 Yamaha XS1100 Sport (Trike Project)
1981 Yamaha XS1100 Sport (Reg'd 1985)
1982 Hesketh V1000 (Pre-Production Engine)

Dave Snr

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Re: Indicators....
« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2016, 01:08:20 PM »
Hi Jeff,

Excellent solution to a common Hesketh problem.
Good write up and pictures. Very neat installation.

I had my second original indicator box start to fail last year - you never knew whether the indicators would work or not.
After talking to Jeff about the Badlands unit, I put one on my Hesketh with the Lucas relay, August last year in time for our Europe trip.
So it's done 3 thousand miles and works perfectly.
The Hazards is a nice option when you're filtering through traffic.
The normal indicators cancel after 11 seconds, but the Hazards stay on until cancelled.

As Jeff mentions, you can use normal bulbs or LEDS, so I spent another £25 on four LED bulbs for the indicators.
Good to reduce the electrical load on the Hesketh wiring and fuses.

Hopefully, Jeff will do version of the write up for the Sock.

Meanwhile, if you're interested, get in touch with Jeff.
It's so embarassing at MOT time, when your indicators refuse to work!

Dave H







Miti

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Re: Indicators....
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2016, 02:12:10 PM »
It's a typical 'Easter Weekend' up here - 'Pishin' Doon..!' so I've stayed inside and put together a write-up that can be downloaded, printed and (for the brave-hearted) used in the garage...

You can download the write-up here:  Indicator Upgrade Write-up

It's an Adobe PDF document that requires the Adobe Reader to open.  If you don't have that facility, you can download and install that via the Adobe website:

The write-up I've uploaded gives details of what the OE wiring is and does and also how to connect the ATS 03 unit with that wiring and the SRB521 Relay.

If you wish to make the 'assembly' I knocked up you'll also need the following:

A piece of 3mm acrylic sheet (perspex) 63 x 95mm;
4 x M4 x 12mm CSK machine screws (with washers and nylok nuts);
3 x crimp butt joints and heatshrink sleeving (I used a type with the sleeving built on);
1 x 5mm screw-down cable tie (to secure the wiring to the acrylic sheet);
6 x 3mm cable-ties (to tidy up the ATS 03 wiring)
2 x 6.3mm male spade terminals with insulating sleeves (to make a link that replaces the flasher relay).
5 x 6.3mm female spade terminals (to connect the SRB521 Relay)

Hope that helps folks

BR

Jeff
« Last Edit: March 28, 2016, 09:10:28 AM by HOCAdmin »
1975 Triumph Trident 750 (New Project)
1980 Yamaha XS1100 (Midnight Special)
1981 Yamaha XS1100 Sport (Trike Project)
1981 Yamaha XS1100 Sport (Reg'd 1985)
1982 Hesketh V1000 (Pre-Production Engine)

Rob B

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Re: Indicators....
« Reply #3 on: March 27, 2016, 01:10:16 PM »
Thanks Jeff!

I ordered the ATS 03 Unit from Amazon for £59 and the SRB521 Relay from AES for £11.00, all with postage. My original Suzuki unit doesn't work from cold but is always working OK by the time I get to the MOT station. However, I think it better to pre-empt the inevitable day when....

I already have relays fitted for the daytime running lights, horn and high beam so one more of them won't hurt....

Thinking of running the HESKETH with daytime running lights, heated grips etc? You can't do it with the original SPARKRITE box because the battery will quickly go flat. Rip out the Sparkrite box and throw it in the furthest hedge, replace it with a BOYER Powerbox, WASSEL, Podtronics or other suitable modern regulator/rectifier and the battery will stay fully charged from the original 3 phase alternator.

RB
RB

1980 Laverda Jota      1981 Laverda 1200
1982 Hesketh V1000     1985 Laverda SFC1000
1995 Triumph Daytona Super III    1960 Perplexed Wife

Miti

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Re: Indicators....
« Reply #4 on: March 28, 2016, 09:31:26 AM »
Nice one Robert...

Those prices have gone up a wee bit since I ordered my parts last year.  IIRC I paid less just under £50 for the ATS 03 and less than £10 for the SRB521 relay...  I know the USD/GBP exchange rate is not in our favour at the moment, perhaps that's the difference..?

I've been running my V1000 with a Shindengen MOSFET rec/reg for a couple of years now...  The whole installation is written up here:

I took out the clock and fitted a voltmeter (to extend battery life and monitor the new system) and all has been very well indeed.  The headlight is still poor though and I think what you have done with relays is almost certainly the correct way forward.  My voltmeter shows the voltage drop when the headlight and/or idicators are used and it's considerable...

Let me know if you need any more info with the ATS03 install...

BR

Jeff
1975 Triumph Trident 750 (New Project)
1980 Yamaha XS1100 (Midnight Special)
1981 Yamaha XS1100 Sport (Trike Project)
1981 Yamaha XS1100 Sport (Reg'd 1985)
1982 Hesketh V1000 (Pre-Production Engine)